David

I will ask Lloyd Shaw to answer your question when he comes into the studio.

Looking at the vibratrimmer.de website (translated into English) the machine looks impressive and has good specs. The website gives lots of information including full contact details which is a good sign.

Mike M

We don’t use any form of lunge in our studio – IVTRB Safety Program.  The risks outweigh the benefits for most people as it’s a difficult position to get right, keeping the knees safe.
Also as you know we only use static poses.

For you– I can’t really comment as you have a different machine to our studios ones and you are responsible for your own correct positioning.

Just lately I have been noticing a lot of benefit from doing dynamic lunges. I've tried them both on the lineal and also pivotal platforms, and also w/o vibration, and it's really helping my low back pain. I always hold on to something while doing them to keep from falling and lower the pressure a bit. The benefit is similar to what I found doing the lat exercise I described earlier (which has fixed my shoulder pain). If I'm right, I could have my low back pain free in a week or so for the first time in years.

Hi,

does anyone have any experience with german  machine vibratrimmer (sport model, I think). It weights 100 kg, has 2 motors( 250 watts) , and supposed to have both lineal and pivotal function and both low and high amplitude in lineal function (2mm and 4mm acording to the sellers site). Anyway I am asking because someone is selling it for half the price (arond 3000 EUR), I think he's closing its studio. What would be your opinion? Could that be a quality macine? Thank you for your answer.

Check out the Machine Reviews here:  http://www.vibration-training-advice.com/machine-reviews

You will see that PowerStep falls into the category: Low Speed Pivotal

This type of machine is often sold with vastly exaggerated advertising promising results that will have you looking like a professional athlete in short time.  Also the machine specs are almost always false.  The website specs state the machine has a range up to 60Mhz – oh my !  They really mean 20-60Hz and even then they are dreaming –  that type of machine runs at about 12Hz – 12 times per second which is okay for the THERAPY results you got. They are trying to make it sound like a true exercise machine and it simply isn’t.  The studies they list on the website were not done on that category or type of machine.

The price is way too high for what you are getting in my opinion.  Look for a resale item on Amazon or locally. There are other brands very similar also but please try before you buy so you know how you respond to the particular brand or particular machine. Similar looking ones can feel quite different. If you buy a new machine check out the warranty carefully.

I’ve told you the bad points, now for the good. It can work well for circulation, gentle stimulation and, as you found, it can give pain relief.  Also it might help improve bone density after some time. Might help you sleep well by giving relaxation and reducing stress (along with pain).

You haven’t told us your age or health or weight.  Beware, this type of machine has lowered performance when the users weight is anything above average.

If the results you got from your trial are what you are wanting, the machine works for you. If you also want fitness and exercise results, I’d be looking at a different machine.

I would like to know if you have ever heard of "power step".  I tried at a local home builders show. I know I know, have no idea why they set up there but I am glad they did.  tried their macine for  about 3 minutes and had fantastic results, i.e. pain relief, head pressure relief.  so I have been trying to research and learn what I can so now I am totally confused.  but did like the feel and results.  so any opinions wouldb e greatly appreciated.  it would be for my personal use as well as my husbands.  he also obtained good pain relief in his knees from this unit which for both of us lasted a number of hours.

thank you.

Why would they want to steal anything. Couldnt they just write their own stuff. Was it copy and paste or paraphrase.

Lloyd wrote many articles and has not been given credit on vibrationtraining.net.  Ted is listed as the author of articles Lloyd wrote.  This still has not been corrected.  Direct plagiarism.

John T. Weatherly

Do you guys think the side plank (plank but up on one elbow & turned sideways) is effective used with VT? Would you put your elbow or your feet up on the platform?

I think this is so true Di.  For example, go to youtube and look at the videos of Nick Winkleman and Power Plate.  Nick works for Athletes Performance and they have been a corporate partner of Power Plate for many years now.  People see stuff like this and blindly copy it.  It is very sad so-called professional organizations like the NSCA give people like Winkleman credibility.  He is speaking on periodization protocols at their national conference this summer.  They have been in bed with Power Plate for years.  I called Mark Verstegen who is Chairman of Athletes Performance numerous times several years ago to ask about his relationship with Power Plate.  Mark would never answer.  And this is somebody I used to correspond with and even wrote a couple advertising articles with several years ago.  Mark even kicked me off his coreperformance.com site several years ago for just asking questions about Power Plate.

John T. Weatherly

The next article I write will be titled - Instructors need to be tough! - After three years of working as a vibration training instructor and sometimes studio manager, plus two years of part time work and with lots of learning and investigating this is perhaps the best advice I can give to people planning to be owners of Vibration Training studios and instructors working in studios or gyms that have machines. 

To be successful in this industry, to have customers who keep training because they are getting great results you need real machines, a real safety program (designed to work with the machines) and real tough instructors - wait for my article for more on this.

An example: In the past two weeks I’ve had 3 or 4 customers straight out lie to me. They tell me another instructor has given them a special position because they have some special needs or an injury. The instructor must then decide immediately if the customer has made up the position - and almost every time, they have. (that’s easy - it’s not part of the Safety Program for training or therapy).  Sometimes they’ve seen a pose on YouTube or another training place and instead of asking if it’s suitable for your machines they just go ahead and try to do it, disregarding the fact that they’ve never seen random poses done and only ever seen people following the Safety Program - shown in big posters on the walls. These people are asked to leave if they argue.

Or, the customer has twisted good advice given to them - Today a regular customer started to do a position that is not training or a therapy pose. I turned the machine off immediately and was then told they had been told by Lloyd Shaw to do exactly what they were doing. They even gave me a good reason, it was because of an injury. 

It was easy to guess what they had actually been told - to put some effort into the program, to hold the poses perfectly because the injury they had would be helped that way.  They construed - keep your heels down hard on the platform (in the squat position) to mean something very different and even argued to continue their error. Their imagined position was so far from anything in Therapy or Training -  I said it was wrong, unsafe, and that ONLY when Lloyd Shaw tells me, then they can do it - believe it or not they still said they were right. 

I’d made that sort of mistake a week ago, allowing a customer to use a different type of machine that he had no reason to use and then correcting him when he used it wrong - because he convinced me he had been told to use it. He’d lied and those who know Lloyd Shaw will realise how much trouble I was in when he found out. 

There was no chance of making that mistake again, today’s customer’s pose was completely random - and dangerous. And more than even a week ago, I’ve become tougher. 

I think the studio needs a new sign that reads - The Customer is Always Wrong! 

I’m thankful for the IVTRB Safety Program. That takes the guess work away so the instructor should get it right at least 99.9% of the time.

Keep up the great work exposing these con artists.  It is quite sad they are so prevalent in the exercise field.  Like you have said, "Bad people prosper when good people do nothing."  It is up to us to clean up the vibration industry by exposing these scams.  Your are leading the way.

John T. Weatherly

I had heard about these vibration machines about a year ago from my chiropractor for building bone density and started doing my research on vibration machine reviews online. While it does seem like there are so many cheap knock offs out there I was looking at the brand that has a medical device number from the FDA, which means they have proven it does what they say it does, it’s the one my chiropractor uses but it is very expensive (over $9,000!) and I don’t a full blown commercial machine for my house. The more research I did I found that the type of movement is very important; moving in 3 fields, up and down, side to side, and back and forth is what all the positive research pointed to. The frequency range it can go to will make a difference, mine goes up to 50hz! The machines weight is also important especially for balance and strength use, you don’t want it to tip over when leaning back into a deep squat or stretch. I tried out a few different models and brands at my local fitness store which really helped me see the difference in quality. The inexpensive ones were not even close to the sturdiness and quality I was feeling using the one at the Dr.’s office. I found a great machine I am really happy with and after 6 month of using it 4 days a week I am happy to report I am no longer in osteopenia (pre-osteoporosis) and have actually had an measurable increase in bone density! I am buying a vibration machine for my mom now because she has osteoporosis and has been on medicine for a few years now with no benefit (and a bunch of scary side effects). I’ll keep you posted but I could not be more thrilled with the machine I bought, well worth it! 

Patty, good to hear from you again. Sorry the Wave still has problems. What are they this time?

YOu might get some idea whether the machine is close to spec by getting a digital tachometer (they sell on ebay for around $10 or so). They come with some reflective tape and use a laser to measure the rpm. Of course you must do some minor math to convert that to Hz. But that can give you an idea of the frequency. I got one and the frequency seems pretty close on mine.

I tried the (very crude) pencil method to try to measure amplitude but even high seemed to only be around 1mm. I asked if I ought to remove that rubber pad that is built in but nobody seems to know.

I have not been real happy with how my body has reacted to VT on a lineal since I got the Wave. But it is more a matter of my health issues than the machine. The machine seems to work fine as far as it goes. I'm left wondering if I might have had better results if I'd gotten a pivotal like the Hypervibe. Lately I do not do much VT.

I finally seem to have my dad’s health stabilized, allowing me to concentrate on my vibration training again. As a reminder, I have the Wave Air Reflex. I have been training consistently for the past 6 weeks - three times per week. I have the machine set at 37 hz and high intensity. I can do the full two minutes on most poses (the push up gives me the most trouble, and sometimes I fatigue at one minute 30 seconds). My question - is it best to continue to increase the hz at 1 hz increments - or should I just move up to the ideal 40 hz. If I do this, should I drop back go two 1 minute poses with the 30 second delay in between poses? Low intensity does nothing for me, so I plan to keep it at high with any change to the hz. I use the treadmill at least 4 times per week, and the biggest thing I have noticed is that my knees do not bother me at all since I have combined the vibration training with the pounding I get on the tread mill.

As a side note, I still have issues with my Wave - but fortunately it is still usable. Wave customer service has not been very responsive, so I will be writing a letter this week. I really wish there was a way to test the machine, as I don’t have any confidence that is operating correctly at all. If you have any recommendations as to how it could be tested, please let me know. I’ve asked them to have someone knowledgeable check out the machine, fix the issues, and also extend my warranty or provide me with a new machine. My rep told me he would have to talk to the owner and get back with me…it will be three weeks tomorrow…not very fast response…perhaps the owner is on a long vacation!

Thanks for all the info you post here...I have been enjoying catching up on all the posts and reading the articles again.

Fake Specs means the machine does not perform to the specifications stated or advertised.

It’s like buying a racing car that says it runs perfectly from 1 – 100 miles per hour but you take it out on the highway and its true maximum speed is 60 miles per hour

The car is useful for around town, not for racing.

DZT V7000 machines are being sold on DealFind.com Victoria, Canada and every where else in Canada.  The machines have fake specs! What do you mean by fake specs

Can you not get some rehabilitation on that machine

Jillie

A low speed pivotal machine can be a starter  – for therapy. It isn’t going to be effective for training and fitness.  The warranty on cheaper machines is not always honoured so be careful how much you pay – maybe get a resale machine. In New Zealand where I live there are many, very many, on auction sites.

I am surprised your Chiropractor has a Crazyfit machine.  There are several models but they do not test accurate to stated specs. 

Maybe wait until you can get a better machine or use finance to get a high speed pivotal, or medium or high energy lineal. Make sure you try both type, you might prefer one over the other.  NEVER stand upright on a lineal machine, it’s never the way to use it; trial the machine using a deep (just above sitting) squat. Sometimes salespeople have no idea how to use the machine and demonstrate them badly – hence my warning.  You can stand upright safely on a pivotal machine set at a lower speed but with back and neck pain I suggest you have soft knees (bent a little).

I have worked through various pains and muscle imbalances using a high energy lineal machine and I prefer that type BUT with both back and neck pain you might like pivotal – I suggest HyperVibe which can be used for therapy through to full workout.  It takes some time to learn how to set the speeds for different body parts. You can check out the recommended Safety Programs here: http://www.vibration-training-advice.com/lineal-and-pivotal-safety-programs

Di Heap, Thank you for the response. I live in the U.S., WA State. I am not overweight, though I am prone to back and neck pain. My aim with a "starter" model is to improve blood flow, bone density, etc., waking up and working my muscles a bit, ideally providing ACTIVE therapy perhaps verging on MILD training. One article on this site mentions the degradation rates of "isolators" in some units, though I couldn not tell whether all machines use isolators or whether they are unique to lineal machines. I got a little spooked, and now I am afraid that with daily use at moderate levels, the inferior internal materials of a therapeutic model will start falling apart in a year or so. Please tell me I am neurotic.

A real student has an intellectual curiosity that results in continual learning.  A fake student is a "know it all" who has no desire to learn anything new.

John T. Weatherly

P.S.  I agree that people that will not even post their names should not be given any credibility on forums like this.