Thanks again,

 Guess my choice will come down to affordability, back up support  and   good detailed guide on how to get the most  out the machine safely.    

Hi Lloyd,

Thanks for the link to the article. I have been reading the report available via Hypervibe and  found the referencing to  Hertz and  G  force  on the different machine helpful, but wasnt sure if   the report is a bit misleading. I noted on your website you have links to  Cardiotech , their commerical machine looks good but not sure how thier  VT12 compares.  A friend of mine has the commercial deluxe from Amazing super health , and enjoys this.  Your reinforecment on the importance of tecnique is much appreciated as this is true for any exercise or exercise machine. I am not really in a position to tray different models which makes choice difficult.

its great to know some one liek youreslf is  passionate about your business and the health  safety  and support  to  consumers 

HI,

 I know you cant recommend one brand against another. I  have narrowed my choice down between two machines. One has a lower amplitude of plate height movement  while the other has a higher plate  movement. Also the G force is different, the higher plate  movement   giving higher G force. I have a bad lower back and weak ankles , knees ,  so my question is.. which machine would cause the least amount of strain on my joints.  I am wanting the machine for toning, strength and enhance  my exercise  , I currently jog, run, circuit train, swim, yoga. I have read somewhere that the higher amount of plate of plate movement the more side to side movement to the joints thus potentially causing  damage, especially to knees and lower back area. Is this true. 

Is there a pose that I can use on the Wave to work the lats? How about the three deltoid heads and the rotator cuff?

The one I came up with for lats is, very similar to plank but on the knees, rest the forearms on the plate with the arms almost straight, head between the elbows, kind of looks like you're praying. Just wanted to see if that's ok and if there's another one.

Mike M

Yes, I found some info about your roller. I have something similar with rigid fingers.  I could never use it on Vibra-Train machines and wouldn’t need to.

Same advice – make sure you don’t get bruising. The other comments are general to your (and anyone else who reads this) training sessions.  Have you tried bare feet or socks on a mat?  – it’s quite different and forces your feet and legs to rebalance and stabilise. 

Di, I use it like a regular foam roller. When you foam roll, mostly you just roll over the roller with things like the legs and hips with your body weight. The roller presses into the muscle giving a massage. The Rumble Roller also has rubber "fingers" which are spaced about 2 inches apart and press into the muscle like the paired thumbs of a skilled masseuse. Adding the vibration to that by rolling over the Wave seems to speed up the process, at least to me. Hope that helps you picture what I'm talking about. Not a workout this time, but massage.

 Hi Dawn,

I understand your interest from a nursing perspective.  For me it started 3 ½ yrs ago with Lloyd’s website!  I would be happy to speak with you.  I have some research documents and experience with clients in a couple of the areas you were questioning.

Feel free to get in touch!

MikeM

The sounds interesting.  Watch for bruising –this appears as tiny red dots (not black areas like regular bruise).  If you get bruising you need to back off a little.

Also remember your rest and recovery times – do not over-train.

Hold perfect position for the duration of each pose– my standard mantra (especially at the start of a new year when I watch over every customer carefully).  I’m wondering how you are managing to hold poses correctly while using the roller – if I’m understanding you, you are using it while using your machine.

Remember Lloyd’s comment – do your vibration machine workouts in socks on a hard foam mat. It isn’t easier; in fact it makes your body work harder by providing a slightly unstable surface.  The mat density – rubber mat – needs to be firm but not rigid like exercise mat flooring, make sure you can press fingers into it a little. We get our mats from a specialist rubber goods shop, not a sports supplier.

I want to share something I discovered re:the trigger point problem. I started using a new item called the Rumble Roller in combination with the Wave and it seems to work well on trigger points. What I do is use the "fingers" that the RR has to apply a vibrating deep tissue massage to the muscles where the trigger points are. Worth a try if you also have this problem.

I would like to ask how many HZ and low or high amplitude needs someone for exercise,strengh

and also for massage.thank you.

Hi Kathleen

Hi Llyod,

Do you have any or know of any DVDs that show good work outs with a vibration machine.  I have watched what you have on you tube which is helpful, however I would like something that i can watch or listen to whilst training.  I have a cardio tech machine however havent used it as i find the instructional poster really hard to follow...  Thanks...

ps Would love to see one of your studios set up in Brisbane or the Gold Coast.  Keep up the good work..

I live in Ohio, not far from Indiana.  Thank you again for your help

DawnUSA

If you contact Brenda (details below) she will advise you how to use a machine with the conditions you listed. I immediately thought of her when I read your post.  I have had contact with Brenda for some years now.  In my opinion the PowerPlate machine is not suitable for you. Knowing what is available in USA I would recommend HyperVibe pivotal machine – Brenda can access one for you for less than $5000. You have not told us where you are located – but Brenda can help regardless of this

Thank you very much for the information.  As far as personal machines are concerned, are you able to recommend one that I can find in the US.  The power plate was the first vibration machine that I had ever heard about.  They cost around 5,000.  Is it possible to get a good personal machine for that price...sorry my question mark is stuck.

Much of the vibration research is invalid as we have covered here in prior posts.  The scientists finally started catching up to Lloyd by publishing a paper about guidelines for vibration research in the fall of 2010.  You may want to google International Society of Musculoskeletal and Neuronal Interactions Guidelines for Vibration Research.  Having said this, more research comes out all the time that appears to validate vibration as an exercise modality.  For example, go to www.nlm.nih.gov, click on PubMed, and use either vibration training or vibration exercise as search terms.  Abstracts of studies can be read.  In some cases, the full text of the articles are available.  But, the research literature has been contaminated by poor research studies that did not even check to see if the platforms performed as stated by the manufacturers before conducting and publishing studies.  How stuff like this gets published in peer-reviewed journals is beyond me.  It shows how lazy and incompetent some researchers have been.  These are the types that accept gifted equipment to do studies on etc.  It also shows how the peer-review system can be flawed when all of these supposedly intelligent researchers let this stuff slide by.  They all "missed the elephant in the room" as Lloyd has said.  Money talks and Venus walks.  Some of these people have been "married to the money."  No morals or ethics.

John T. Weatherly

I am looking for a vibration machine for my home.  Everything that is advertised in the US is on your blacklist.  I have been reading everything I can find on vibration training, but cannot seem to find a quality machine for individual use.  I work on an OrthoNeuro  unit in a hospital and have been talking with some of the surgeons about these machines.  I cant find very much information, legitimate information, about use after spine, cervical or joint surgeries.  I would appreciate any information or websites.  

Well, I have been suspended from the Sport Science Group at strengthperformance.com.  No reason was given for my suspension.  I suspect it was because I kept hammering on the fake specs with vibration platforms issue and the guy that oversees the group has a facility in Las Vegas that does vibration treatments.  No explanation at all for my suspension in spite of my requests for an explanation from administrators of the site.  They just deleted the entire discussion and suspended me.  So much for freedom of speech.

John T. Weatherly

Another success story – and further proof that often “Less is More” when using pure vibration training.

The lady I asked about below (fully fused neck and a large lower back injury) is now doing a series of basic squats (holding the front handlebar of machine) and assisted squats (using side vibrating handlebars) to workout her arms also; with a double heavy rubber mat on the machine to take a little of the pressure out yet allow her to sink down into a perfect  110 degree squat.  Also 2 x 60 second anti-cellulite massage which she doesn’t find comfortable.  

Added in pivotal work, (part way through session) standing locklegged 2 x 90 seconds at 6hz on a workout machine. She barely tolerates this as it throws her around a little.  At the end of her session she uses a very low speed, low amplitude pivotal machine for 5 minutes standing upright. This is similar to what she has used previously in a hospital.

She is tired at the end of this simple program and she said she felt exhausted once she got home – she came back today and asked for exactly the same program over again!

Her unfit and uncoordinated  husband is now doing the IVTRB Safety Program perfectly.  The success of  people who would not otherwise do any regular exercise is one of the things that makes my job so good.

I contact about 2 sites a week who use my work to get sales. Most just ignore me.

Our best bet to stop that BS is to get influential enough to educate the consumer directly.

Thanks Peter

Isn’t it interesting how marketers use facts and figures in incorrect ways – twisting the truth. 50Hz is not the machine speed but the frequency of the power input – it’s a clever way to make a machine sound powerful.

They have attributed the article to Lloyd Shaw so that is good.

Crazyfit/Crazyslim  machines won’t give the sort of results that Lloyd talks about in the article but they do give some stimulation – so again they are stretching the truth. One can only hope people want to read of what Lloyd has to say so they search and find this and other reputable sites.
( Lloyd may want to comment further when he reads this forum)

For those who want to know more about the cheap pivotal machines like Crazyfit read here

http://www.vibration-training-advice.com/general-consumer-warning-about-cheap-pivotals

http://www.vibration-training-advice.com/no-such-thing-as-a-bad-machine