Thank you for the information.  As far as the misleading marketing, you must be commenting on the true whole body vibration claims at least to an extent.  The Versaclimber is a fine device.  I am just wondering about the claims of more total vibration to the body with the vibrating Versaclimber.  If the vibration is superficial and light, it must not do a whole lot.

John Weatherly

In 2003, while consulting with Versaclimber, I advised them to pursue a broad patent pending to superimpose vibration on wide array of exercise equipment.  The patent pending went through in 2005 and they have been selling the vibrating Versaclimber.  I am curious as to where this may fit in the machine categories Lloyd has listed.  See www.versaclimber.com and click on Exervibe.  As far as I know, the vibrating Versaclimber only operates at 30 Hz.  I got into it with them when the patent pending went through and I was not being compensated appropriately for what I did for them.  This included other things such as their Versapulley and not just vibration.  I felt close to the GM and part owner of this company, and we have not spoken since 2005.  This is sad. 

John Weatherly

Hi, I live in Laval, Canada

Does someone know where I can try this VibraTrain out  

Thanks for your support Sally. Funny Ive been wondering how many of these are going to be in the landfills like many things in our society. Dan and I have often talked about starting a reconditioning program where these machines can be fixed and donated withing communities once we have deemed they are safe to use. I for one as a business owner would by far prefer to invest in a quality piece of equipment than have to replace it every 3 to 6 months.  Doesnt make much business sense.

Meena...the reason to go to a studio or gym is to hopefully learn how to first use the equipment properly, providing you have a good trainer. If not, the information is out there...you just have to read it and start to apply that knowledge. Secondly, a decent machine will give you the results you are looking for if the training and effort are combined. NOTHING WORTH DOING IS EVER EASY. Thats why diets pills never do work. Mass production will only win if we as consumers allow them to by buying their crap. This is exactly the point of this forum. We are collectively trying to stop this one consumer at a time.

Sally

Nobody will,its all controled by mass production which is the winner everytime.

If you can buy a machine for USD200 why would you pay 10K or go to a gym or studio to train

No brainer really

Good day all, boy Lloyd you are quite the popular guy for the attackers coming on here.

We still love you though

Good to see Mr Yeaman where he belongs, hopefully he will see a nice long stint in the pokey.  He looks like crap but I am glad karma finally caught up with him.

Offsetting the attackers, I have been following lloyds and his communities advice and work for well over 2 years now, in that time he has never pressured us in any way to buy or invest with him or VibraTrain, he has been nothing but a gentleman in his advice, openness and support.  Something we dont see from the manufacturers or distributors very often.

Having ambition is not a bad thing and being passionate is exactly what the industry needs.  Being in Canada we are going through exactly the same situations seen in Europe and Australia etc..  The US is also being bombarded with junk  as well.

To those looking to take advantage of our markets made up of friends, family and neighbours you will meet the same pressure from us and people like us we like Lloyd will not back down due to threats.  We want longevity, honesty and integrity not a quick buck and are willing to support or contribute whatever we can when ever we can..  Its happened before and will happen again but people are taking notice of you Lloyd and are seeking your advice and the advice of those you support you regardless of the haters as they very quickly make themselves look foolish.

Google searches will matter less and less as time goes on as your site and advice is hitting the papers and local communities across the world by people willing to bring important knowledge and information to the rest of their communities.

Take Care,

BB

Please read some of the articles here:

www.vibration-training-advice.com/consumer-guide-and-safety-program

You can read about the types of machines (home and studio) here:

www.vibration-training-advice.com/machine-reviews

Then if you have further questions we are happy to answer them.  As Philippa said we need to know more about what results you want and if you have any injuries or health problems.

BB

Please tell us a bit more about your goals and budget so we can best advise.

Please please help.

Been doing research for a vibra training machine for me and my bf to buy and keep at our home. problem is I reallydont know which one. We live in L.a and there is a spa here that offers to try out hte machine for a daypass of 200 dollars. We would rather just purchase our own. please give me advice on which one works best..

any advice helps.

every site ive been on says different things... I was intersted in getting the vibraslim then i visited this site and its blacklisted...

Hi all,

The responses have been really helpful (well most of them).

Phillipa - I am going to rest my knees until the end of Feb and then try to come back into VT. I can't stop going because I truly do love coming and the results are amazing. I think I'll also get my bike out and try gentle cycles for a while as well as continuing to walk my dog twice a day.

Dean - When I had surgery they reconstructed the anterior cruciate ligament, repaired the posterior cruciate and the medial ligament, 'trimmed' the cartilage and also the synovial membrane, but it was such a long time ago ( Feb 1992) I'm a bit hazy. I'm sure carrying so much excess weight (5 stone at my worst) for so many years hasn't done me any favours either. If I am simply bending my knees without putting weight on them there is no noise or pain – I can pull my foot up to touch my bottom easily.

Lloyd – I only really started to exercise again about a year ago after I started to lose weight.

Di – Thanks for your comments – I’ll definitely bear them in mind

Katrina :o)

Katrina

Did you have your knee examined by orthopedic specialist or physiotherapist?
Do you have X-ray images of it, and would you provide us with radiologist reading of that images. (You can do that directly on my e-mail, Phillipa can provide you with it).
Your symptoms are pointing on cartilage disorder, most probably with your patelofemoral joints. But they can also be combined with menisceal tear, especially after that trauma you described, and complex reconstructive surgery (if there was any, you didn't specified). After such surgery, even when it is done by foremost specialist, knee is never aligned perfectly as it was before injury.

If there is only cartilage disorder, than combination of cycling or elliptical trainer with vibration training would be good solution for your knee problems. Although vibration training provide you with better blood circulation and muscle strength, joint cartilage is fed from joint fluid like a sponge, and need some cardio workout to be fit, especially when is damaged.

Jazz
Human body is not designed for lots of things that we do regularly, such as cycling, skiing, swimming, weight lifting, rowing, golf, tennis, rugby, and CURLING ;)

Up until a just over year ago I worked in one of the UKs most prestigious hospitals;  a university hospital.  I can assure you that even there the physios, leaders in their field,  knew nothing about, had never tried vibration training and had no interest in learning about anything his new.  It is for this reason that I can be sceptical about some physios.  To date I have not met any or encountered first hand (i.e. not fictitous web personas)  physios who have tried good vibration training who do not think it exteremely beneficial for rehab.  We have physios who come to us, who have trained with us to set up their own studios and who have recommended clients to us.  We have seen case after case where people have seen huge improvements in knee pain and other conditions.  Yes physios do see some ill effects from poorly controlled vibration training and some snap to an instant judgement that all is suspect. 

Karlon - I'd love to know what blog you were reading or which parallel universe you are inhabiting whereby you got the information that I was pushing my client harder as a result of doctor's advice.  In fact, had you bothered to read (or indeed if you are able to read?) the post - you would see that in fact it is because we value our client's safety that we recommend she seeks advice outside our studio.  It is for the very reasons you point out,  that people SHOULD seek advice from many sources .  I think the fact you fail to have gleaned this very basic information suggests you do not simple information retrieval skills.     I find it such a pity that someone comes the forum to get advice from GENUINE people whose aim is to help and not put people at risk, is having to listent to the nonsense that appears here and makes it difficult to get anywhere. I realise that is your point in posting; a wish to sabotage.   You must feel very proud of your achievements to date. 

Katrina - I can only apologise and can only hope you get some more intelligent responses soon.

Katrina

Lloyd will give you all the info you need in a few hours but I’ll start. What ongoing training did your surgeon or therapist advise

A stationary bike is great for knees as it gets fluid moving around the joint and as long as it’s set up correctly it helps with alignment.  Make sure you pedal down and then up with heels pointed down (not your toes) and don’t quite extend your leg straight.

Unfortunately Jazz is misinformed about Vibration Machines.  I’m guessing he’s never tried a high force (good) one.   You must be in perfect position just as Philippa shows you, in the squat position being careful not to extend your knees forward of your toes and making sure your feet are straight and hip (bone) width apart.   Watch that your knees stay in alignment and not coming inward during the time. 

For me Vibration Training (on Vibra-Train) machines has sped up recovery.  Other very important points are to be very careful when/if you do positions that require you to kneel  - get up slowly taking care not to twist your knees.  Also lots of care stepping off the machines. Always count to 10 first to allow fatigued leg muscles to recover and so be able to support you.  If you step down right away as timer stops your knees take the impact of that step.  Also do position 9 Super Squat facing and holding the handlebars – that is, a repeat of position 1. You need the support holding on gives.

After training be careful for an hour or two, don’t run to catch a bus!  Your body recovers, repairs and begins to build new muscle fibre.  Eat a high protein meal to further help this process.

Hi Jazz

Can you tell us a bit about yourself please.  Do you have a studio or run a practice?  Can you tell us where if so?  Thanks - just good to know from what background your opinion is coming.

Hi Katrina

Good to see you here.  Katrina trains with us .  We said to come on here to get unbiased advice.  She is one of our star vibrators so we dont want to lose her and didnt want her to feel that we were not giving the full story so we said to consult the worlds experts on here.  I know Di is knee expert extraordinaire. 

Hi Katrina

Can you tell us where you train, the name of the machines you are using? and do you follow Vibra-Trains safety program? You should not be doing the lunge position. http://www.vibra-train.com/exercises-bullet.html

Have you read the article below on precise joint angles?

http://www.vibration-training-advice.com/vibration-training-and-precise-joint-angles

Hi, I need some advice about Vibration Training and knees. I have been going to VT since July last year and have been absolutely delighted with  the results. I have lost more than 16kg in weight and gone from a size 16 to a size 10. My problem is that my knees seem to be crunching very loudly when I crouch or kneel down, or walk up the stairs. When I put my hand over the knee joint I can feel the joint grinding inside. I dont feel pain when I am actually training but the pain kicks in afterwards. When I kneel or crouch right down my knees seem to lock and I feel pain for about 5 minutes but then they are fine again. My knees have always clicked but the grating has only recently started.

I went to see my GP and he told me to stop going to VT as I was damaging my knees even more and would end up needing a knee replacement. I like to think he was just using scare tactics through ignorance.

I had a skiing accident in 1992 and needed surgery as i damaged the anterior and posterior cruciate ligaments, medial ligament, cartilage and synovial membrane.

Does anyone have any advice as to whether I can carry on using the machines or not, or if there are any alternative positions that would put less pressure through my knees.

The trainers at the studio are fantastic and suggested I see if I can get some more advice from this forum. I really do not want to have to stop.

Thanks

Katrina